• Välkommen till ett uppdaterat Klocksnack.se

    Efter ett digert arbete är nu den största uppdateringen av Klocksnack.se någonsin klar att se dagens ljus.
    Forumet kommer nu bli ännu snabbare, mer lättanvänt och framför allt fyllt med nya funktioner.

    Vi har skapat en tråd på diskussionsdelen för feedback och tekniska frågeställningar.

    Tack för att ni är med och skapar Skandinaviens bästa klockforum!

    /Hook & Leben

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pereztroika

pereztroika

Breitling
oystercase skrev:
Sorry for a long text. Really did not want to go into these murky waters but also didn't feel to leave it unanswered. This is not an opening for an online debate or pie throwing so I won't respond further but hope I make my stand clear. I also beleive that you misinterpreted some of what I wrote, guess it got lost in translation?

I don't think that what I have seen with my own eyes count as "unverified rumors". I actually don't think that the way you started out in the Panerai world is a bad background for later becoming an expert in what is original and not (just like Frank Abagnale) . What I don't like is that you tried to cover it up, it would have been easy to just be open with it. It was also just a minor reflection from my part and I never accused you of being any kind of master faker pushing fake Panerais or scamming people, but making "historical correct" remanufactured spare parts for Panerais is for me the same murky waters as where the so called "faker gang" swims.
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What you have seen with your own eyes is all smoke and mirrors my friend. Screenshots taken out of context, lacking crucial information and sometimes even completely made-up to paint a very specific picture of me. It's like watching Fox News, you only get to see what they want you to see.

Let me tell you how I really started out in Panerai. I've been hooked with Panerai since 1998 and in 2005, I bought my first PAM 111 with sausage dial. In 2012, I bought a 372 and this was the very watch that got me into vintage Panerai. That's when I found the Homageforum. My Homageform membership was never a secret. As a matter of fact it was brought up against me right after my first posts on Paneristi.com in 2015. All the relevant people knew about it. I even mentioned the forum in my first interview with ABlogToWatch in March 2016. Not by name, as I didn't want to upset the people over there (who ultimatelly got upset anyway). However, there was no cover-up.

Also, I never made any historically correct spare parts. The modern Panerai did, they remanufactured several Angelus 240 bridges to fool prospective buyers into believing the movements were historical G. Panerai e Figlio movements.

https://perezcope.com/2016/11/04/the-truth-about-the-pam-203/

oystercase skrev:
Regarding the "known faker gang", again those acted in different times even before originality became a hard-core need in the vintage watch game. They bought parts and semi-finnished watches when they could and tried to make "ok" watches out of it from the unfinished watches and parts they were sitting on. This was before big money hit the scene. Where they fakers? No, but they were reckless with history and originality and so where many many collectors and dealers at those times. This is of course a loss looking back. Right or wrong is not a sharp line but a grey area. We can see exactly the same thing with other antiques, missing or broken parts get replaced and it does not make those fake (they would of course be less valuable than a 100% original) . Everyone was doing shit like this and yes in hindsight they probably crossed the line more than once and it is a problem whe it comes to originality today. They were surely ignorant by today's standards but that is not same as being full out crocked. Then every Italian vintage dealer would be in the same gang. Knowing what we know know and how we look at originality in the watch world today, if someone would be doing this now. It would surely be scamming.
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Yes, they were/are fakers, total crooks and still very operational: https://perezcope.com/2018/12/17/fake-rolex-panerai-3646-on-chrono24/


Cheers, Jose
 
oystercase

oystercase

Cartier
pereztroika skrev:
What you have seen with your own eyes is all smoke and mirrors my friend. Screenshots taken out of context, lacking crucial information and sometimes even completely made-up to paint a very specific picture of me. It's like watching Fox News, you only get to see what they want you to see.
...
Klicka för att se resterande...

You are quite wrong when you claim that all I have seen is" screenshots taken out of context" . That is exactly the kind of assumptions spelled out as truth that I don't like. But lets leave it with that. I am not here to pick a fight just wanted to clarify my view that obviously differ from what you want to hear.

PS. exposing bad watches that appear on auctions etc is good and something that benefit the watch community. keep that going! But keep it to the actual watches and the actual fact for those specific watches. DS
 
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johnz

johnz

Rolex
8BDD65A3-8D8F-46C3-A8E3-3E9AB804C3A6.jpeg
God morgon!

Tänkte ta med er på en för mig stor Panerai-dag. Start på Arlanda nu, ny uppdatering om tre timmar. Häng me’!
 
koze

koze

Panerai
2-Faktor
Jag är snart tillbaka i klubben och kommer omedelbart vilja slänga på ett bra canvas, så om någon har något liggandes så är jag idel öra :)
 
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